Both Kerdi Board and cement board are designed to smooth out uneven spots on the installation surface, create an unbending layer that wont flex underfoot, and also provide a waterproof barrier. DIYers on this forum seem to have nothing but problems with Hardi. Most of the entries in the NAME column of the output from lsof +D /tmp do not begin with /tmp. Step 4: Place the Tile. Not everyone knows how to do mud and lathe it's so old school plus it wears you out, ive been a setter for 27 yrs and I have yet to go back to one of my showers I installed using perma base or durock, with a liner, i have started using waterproofing such as redguard or aqua-defense. The difference between the phonemes /p/ and /b/ in Japanese. Once the primer is completely dry, use a roller or brush to apply a coat of your chosen KERDI membrane adhesive over the entire surface of the wall, overlapping the edges slightly for full coverage. Tile can be installed directly over Kerdi-Board using the thinset method; For use with ceramic and natural stone tile; Return Policy; California residents. There is a product called Kerdiboard you might want to look into. Cement board is particularly vulnerable to water damage, so waterproofing can help protect it and help it last longer. modified thin-set mortar is not recommended to set ceramic and stone tile, including large format tiles, over the KERDI membrane. Yeah it seems that the only products that will be compatible with cement board and the kerdi membrane are bostik ditra-set and schluter all-set (or one of schluters other products). if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[580,400],'remodelormove_com-large-mobile-banner-1','ezslot_17',164,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-large-mobile-banner-1-0');As an added precaution, you may want to consider to adding a water-resistant layer afterwards, such as a caulking or flashing tape. A good rule of thumb is 24 hours per inch of thickness, then one more day on top of that to be sure. We recommend our users to update the browser. I used this to seal a 3 1/2 by 6 1/2 foot shower with 7 foot walls. In order to determine which tile underlayment is right for your project, you need to know which issue youre trying to solve whether its preventing subfloor cracks from transferring to the tile, soundproofing, moisture protection, or providing more rigidity to the tile. We use a pump action garden sprayer and its usually dry by the time we clean the sprayer. More waste, yes, but I think you have to have a LOT of practice to hang those huge sheets like mongo does. see Prop 65 WARNINGS. When applying the thin-set, it should be applied in such a way that it fully fills any empty space between the Tile and Schluter product and is solid enough to support the weight of the tiles being installed. The surface of Wedi is perfect for bonding. After today's tutorial, you'll gain the confidence to transform your old bathroom into a new space. You don't want to block off the end of the air chanel and trap half a sheet worth of air under there.-Not paying attention to the direction of my knife. The great thing about Kerdi Board is that it is lightweight and easier to maneuver. When installing KERDI with unmodified thin-set mortar over particularly dry and porous substrates, it is recommended to wet the substrate first, in order to help prevent premature drying or skinning of the thin-set mortar. If cement board had been used, most likely the damage would have been much less that what I have to deal with now. This allows for future compression and an area at the corner where things are more forgiving. They are absorbed into the surface material and help keep moisture away from the substrate surface. One of the major benefits of opting for Kerdi Board over cement board is the ease of installation. . Do I have to use Kerdi tape with Ditra membrane? How "tidy" does the kerdi band need to be? You probably have to go to a big box store's special order desk or find a specialty tile supplier to find it. The thickness of the tile is important, and should be known, but not because it changes the method of building. The main issue caused by non-waterproof cement boards is the eventual warping and damage to the tiles, making it difficult and costly to fix without removing all the tile and starting over. 120 sq feet including the floor. ), Schluter SET, ALL-SET, FAST-SET or an unmodified thin-set mortar is recommended. Like cement board, the boards are heavy and hard to cut. Anytime Mongo. Yes, Hardie board needs to be waterproofed. Additionally, you can use KERDI-BAND around corners, seams, and joints to help with a waterproof installation. You troweled on thinset combing it out then pressed the Kerdi into place? Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. The perfect fold is tricky and many of my first steam showers where built without the sealed slip joint. Maybe try another brand of thinset? No, that doesn't sound right. You can apply it on PVC, metal, slabs, walls, and floors. The main types of cement board you could encounter are Fibre Reinforced Cement (FRC) board and gypsum board. How should I transition between cement board floor and alcove tub? A mortar wall is better and can be customized easier. Creative, C'mon over for a beer! This product is available in 3/16", 3/8", 1/2", 5/8" 3/4", 1" 1-1/2" and 2" thicknesses, allowing for a wide variety of installation options. Portland cement-based unmodified thin-set mortars are dependent on the presence of moisture for hydration in order to gain strength. When installing KERDI with . Though, each product comes with its own individual characteristics, and pros and cons. Once the adhesive has been applied and has had time to properly cure, then the KERDI membrane can be applied to the wall. One thing I do like fibercement (Hardie) for is when I need thin strips of cement board. A 1/2-inch thick, 3 x 5 foot sheet weighs just 7-1/2 pounds, compared with 45 pounds for a similar size sheet of cement board. Ultimately, the decision between a Schlter system or a cement board comes down to the particular application and the goals the user has for the floor system. There's a really great manual (with diagrams) that makes this all easier to understand. Finally, use a roller or brush to ensure that the membrane is secure and has no wrinkles or air bubbles. Schluter says that the Kerdi membrane and tile can be installed over standard gypsum wall board without any problems. (3ft-3in wide). It also helped me to work in smaller sheets. Depending on your project and the specific cement board you are using, you will want to select a thinset appropriate for both.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-large-leaderboard-2','ezslot_15',158,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-large-leaderboard-2-0'); The two primary criteria to help guide your selection are the type of cement board you are using and whether you are installing it indoors or outdoors. And by 'booking the Kerdi' I mean we put it in the bathtub, sprayed it with the handshower, then booked it (just like wallpaper). True cement board (Durck, Wonderboard) is my first choice as a tile or Kerdi backer. Yes, you should prime drywall before installing KERDI in order to ensure proper adhesion and a successful installation. It doesn't matter but you absolutely need to use both a substrate and a waterproofing membrane. Whether or not you need a Kerdi membrane is a factor of use. I simply sponge off the excess. The manual can be found here: http://floorelf.com/waterproof, I would say unless you are experienced in working with Schluter-Kerdi waterproofing membrane kit, then I would say work with an easier waterproofing approach, either liquid waterproofing or a combination of liquid and traditional waterproofing (plastic covering the wood frame). This will prevent water from entering from behind the membrane, and will provide a more secure waterproof layer. This flexible polyethylene layer is easy to install and can protect the tile from both cracking and moisture. Aquadefense is approved by IAPMO for use as a shower pan liner, but be sure to check your local building codes, as some areas of the country still require the PVC liner. Properly waterproofed Hardie board should last for many years. Rolling pin, good, now I can throw away my magnesium float.LOLCasey. If I go the kerdi membrane route, do I still need to tape the joints before installing the kerdi membrane . Need help liner vs liquid membrane question. Cement board and grout are not water proof, if there's Kerdi no moisture is ever going to be able to get behind it. Gettin' a little delirious. RedGard On Hardibacker Board. Installation. Preparing drywall for KERDI membrane requires a few important steps to ensure a successful application. Kerdi, a waterproofing membrane made of a special polyethylene fabric, should be allowed to completely dry prior to tiling. That would tell him where the edge of the framing needs to be. I trust it and have never had a callback. It only takes a minute to sign up. In normal residential use I wouldn't worry about it. I like to use a garden sprayer to keep the thirsty Kerdi wet. What I would be most scared off is the fact that no inside or outside corners appear to have been used. When it comes to installation, a Schlter system is typically easier to install than a cement board, and it also allows for more design freedom as it does not require a traditional waterproof layer. Your email address will not be published. We are no longer supporting IE (Internet Explorer), Do not Sell or Share My Personal Information. We sponge water onto the cement board. For the floor, he should've put a mortar bed, then a membrane that goes over the curb, then another mortar bed. If a law is new but its interpretation is vague, can the courts directly ask the drafters the intent and official interpretation of their law? It's still applied to cement board. It costs more but it;s worth it for the ease of install IMO. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Will use the Schluter Shower system. Overall, putting Kerdi over regular drywall can be done, with the proper steps in place to properly install the membrane and its components. #2 - Your suggestion has plenty of merit though. How to follow the signal when reading the schematic? Applying a conventional cement backer board to such a structure is almost impossible. Can I install Kerdi board just on the walls of my shower and use a PVC membrane on the floor? Once its applied, the last step is to follow up the waterproof coating with a waterproof sealant. There is definitely skill & planning required to doit right. Schulter Ditra is manufactured by Schluter Systems and is a 1/8 thick polyethylene uncoupling membrane that is specifically designed for tile installations. When it comes to applying KERDI, however, it is advised to use a regular thinset that includes portland cement as its main component. This makes Kerdi Board suitable for a wide variety of interior applications, including kitchen countertops. Kerdi's systems are fairly reputable. When cleaning thinset off of Schluter membranes, the manufacturer recommends using a wet sponge and taking care to avoid any scoring or inconsistencies on the surface of the membrane. Then you can apply a thin layer of KERDI-FIX to the board, the membrane over top . Learn about the options in exterior siding before you choose, Before you pick up a single tile, pull from these tips for expert results, Slip resistance, curves and even the mineral content of your water all affect which tile is best for your shower, We help a Houzz user ask all the right questions for designing a stylish, practical and safe shower bench, This isn't a light DIY project: You'll need heavy-duty tools and plenty of protection for your home and yourself, In steamy quarters, tile needs to stand up to all that water and vapor in style. Once this is done, continue the installation by following the directions for the particular Kerdi product being used. In jobsite conditions and over a long time, who knows. Not even the plumber's fault as it was just a bad valve. Cement board is the industry standard when it comes to tile substrates and the most preferred among professionals when installing porcelain or ceramic tile. Kerdi Board as a whole is much easier to install than Cement Board. Blocking should be constant across this area when openings are larger than your fist. Like the example above. To line niche shelves, for instance. The type of bonding mortar used to apply KERDI must be suitable for the substrate and must penetrate and engage the membrane fleece. To properly seal a cement board for a shower, its important to first properly prepare the surface. Look at it this way; Withe Kerdi, you either trust it or you don't. Whether youre installing tile on a floor, wall, or countertop, choosing the right type of substrate, or underlayment, is critical to preventing breaks and cracks in both the tile and the grout. The cement board needs to be clean, free of debris, and dry. This will help to ensure that all drywall is completely covered. What precautions should I take installing tile on a backerboard in an area surrounded by cement? Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. Yes, Kerdi membrane can be installed over plywood. To put things into perspective, consider that a tile floor is made up of three layers: the subfloor, the underlayment, and the tile surface you walk on. Anyone who has done more than 1 shower shouldn't start without knowing that. One thing I do like fibercement (Hardie) for is when I need thin strips of cement board. I set the Kerdi with my hands, pat it into the thinset with my hands, then go over it with a 4" taping knife held at a low angle to embed the Kerdi in the thinset. Go with smaller bags or only mix half. rev2023.3.3.43278. And second, since its foam, the board is super easy to cut with just a utility knife. Once the membrane is in place, it can be sealed and reinforced with Kerdi-Fix sealant, Kerdi band, and Kerdi-Drain for added waterproofing strength. BTW the older Kerdi thread referencedwas excellent. So long as the seams and joint areas are properly prepared, the panels can also provide waterproofing. The thin-set mortar should be mixed to a fairly dry consistency and then spread on the surface with a 1/4 inch square notch trowel. The cement board needs to be clean, free of debris, and dry. First, felt paper is stapled to the floor and covered with expanded metal lath. And second, since it's foam, the board is super easy to cut with just a utility knife. Plus, if you use the mold and moisture resistant drywall, it will be extra insurance against mold. Dean, our tile consultant, says glass mat backer board is his first choice due to the ease of installation, cost, and because his workers like it. How do you show the depth of a hole in a drawing? Depending on factors such as room temperature, humidity, and ventilation in the area, this could take anywhere from 1 to 3 days. Why you use cement board? The curb doesn't have to be any wider than a 2x4. What do you mean it doesn't adhere? What? Now there's nothing particularly wrong with fiber-cementit's just not my first choice. Or will the Kerdi membrane (with seams taped with kerdi band) prevent each board from moving independently? A place where magic is studied and practiced? On the downside, the cement boards are heavy, somewhat difficult to cut and can leave abrasive sandy crumbs that can damage tubs and shower bases if youre not careful. It is easier to cut than cement board, it is mold resistant, and it has a built-in moisture barrier. The fastest method [for me and possibly other dilettants] is to stroke the knife at a diagonal to the comb marks, top down, center out, pushing all the air before you with short, overlapping strokes.-Thinset needs to be pretty darn wet: Needs to stay put when combed, but should be soft and shiney. that's home depot homeowner installation method. 4. Will use the Schluter Shower system. Also are you saying that you wet ("booking the Kerdi") the Kerdi, as well? With Kerdi Board you get to enjoy an effective product that is lightweight, easy to cut, waterproof, and leaves behind no dust! But I can't give you a +1 because telling someone to mortar all the walls in a large shower is like telling them to make an ice sculpture. Sure, you can do it.just be sure to "spritz" or wet the hardi thoroughly before.it's pretty "thirsty.". It is important to seal any imperfections in the drywall to ensure a long-lasting installation and to minimize water infiltration. You still use metal lath, but then mix bags of powder and pour the soupy mix onto the floor. If youre not careful, the boards can also leave behind abrasive sandy crumbs that can cause damage to your shower base or tub. Installation instructions vary depending on the type of Kerdi membrane being used, but typically the membrane is applied directly to a clean, dry plywood surface that is free from dust, dirt, and other debris. After priming, use an approved adhesive to adhere the KERDI membrane to the drywall, making sure the edges are well sealed and joints are tight.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4','ezslot_12',156,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4-0'); A successful installation of KERDI requires well-prepared surfaces and a proper application, so take the time to properly prime the drywall before installation. Backerboard plus a waterproofing membrane like Redgard is all that is needed for tub surrounds with thinset then tile. I still wet the walls first. Let's start! Home Improvement Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for contractors and serious DIYers. To waterproof Hardie board, you should choose a quality sealer that is designed for use on cement-based sidings. The product involves an extruded polystyrene foam panel, with specialized reinforcement materials on both sides. But I did want to understand the cost breakdown as the walls then become WAY more expensive than it would be with Redguard. What's the difference between a power rail and a signal line? The drywall's back side fails, and it's just as bad or worse than it was on the tile side. When applying thin-set mortar, the manufacturers instructions should be followed closely. I hang Kerdi on cement board and fibercement board all the time. Will be doing a bathroom gut and will be laying durock cement board over plywood sub floor. This allows the cement to properly hydrate, resulting in a strong, dense bond coat. Step 3: Apply Thinset. Your air bubbles will travel along the valleys you've made, and it's way better if you only have to move them 20 inches to the nearest edge rather than all the way from the ceiling to the floor [Again, Mongo can, but he has mad skills].-Not paying attention to the principle of bedding top down, center out. Ideally the DalSeal TS would fold into the gap between the wall and ceiling concrete board. The most important thing to remember when applying the membrane over the cement board is to make sure the surface is clean and free of any debris, dust or other contaminants. See the foam bench and the corners. Once all areas have been properly waterproofed, the walls can be tiled and grouted to create a waterproof surface. Additionally, if the cement board isnt waterproof, it can also cause mold and mildew issues, as well as dry wall damage from the moisture seeping through. Is it suspicious or odd to stand by the gate of a GA airport watching the planes? I'm thirsty. Hardie board is a cement-based siding product that is water-resistant, but not waterproof.
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